Recommendation: Dresden Dolls/Amanda Palmer
A recommends…
The Dresden Dolls/Amanda Palmer
Musical artist
Musical artist
Amanda Palmer is beautiful, talented, and a genderbender extraordinaire. Whether she’s with her duo The Dresden Dolls or just by herself, she’s got a way of performing that is awesomely theatrical and passionate. She creates music with her entire body, pouring all of herself into her songs. I recommend her for this community not only for her style (check out the video for “Backstabber” by The Dresden Dolls, if you don’t believe me) but for the content of her songs. In this recommendation, I’ve put a link to “Half Jack”. It echoes a lot of the sentiments I’ve heard here and… I don’t know, I just think you should check it out.
Posted by xMech on January 20th, 2011 at 08:00 am
Category: music, recommendations 43 comments »
January 20th, 2011 at 8:08 am |
Too bad she hates women who don’t fit her very narrow standards, fat people and the disabled and couldn’t sincerely apologize for her wrongdoings if she tried…
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January 20th, 2011 at 8:40 am |
I laughed because I thought you were being clever and satirical…and then I realized, you were seriously serious…seriously?!
What narrow standards does a woman who dresses like a statue, has eyebrows that look like tribal tattoos, hangs out with mimes, doesn’t shave her armpits and writes songs about pubic hair have, what narrow standards would someone who is seen out with kevin smith and margaret cho have? Both people who have weight problems I may add have a HUGE queer fanbase…chasing amy anyone? loving his gay brother anyone?
Her record company once told her she couldn’t show her own stomach in a music video since she was clearly too far herself, and therefore no one would enjoy the video… She received overwhelming support from her fans who wrote “reBELLYon” on their disgusting obese stomachs and she thanked them for their support, I don’t know any thin amanda palmer fans, but fat people must be some kind of herd animal like cows or something else thats fat, not an idealistically thin animal that stays within the confines of what the other orwellian animals on the animal farm think right?
The disabled, she was character acting for a performance piece with a man, who wore the same dress, not each their own make of the same dress but literally the same dress, because they were pretending to be conjoined twins, oh right, conjoined twins, they never once called them “siamese twins” because they were born in america and not siam. That being said, no one is allowed to sing about things that did not personally happen to them or write about it. If it is not autobiographical it is in bad taste. When a straight person plays a gay person they’re condemned, take that sean penn in milk! And also no musical artist has ever written about the achievements of a person differently abled, the who’s “tommy” which was about a blind, deaf, dumb boy never happened, and if it was written…then because it was oh so very morally wrong I’m sure they did not receive positive feed back from the critics. The album was written to reflect how sometimes in a relationship you can be with someone whos as close as skin to you but can still make you feel smothered and alone at the same time… but metaphor must be an awfully big word for someone who didn’t bother remembering how to spell their own userhandle…
–That being her bandmate brian is in the cliks [I think that lukas is over-rated but I 100% respect what he’s done for the transcommunity] I think it’s fantastic that Amanda kisses Kelly from the OMGSHOES video, and treats it as a fiesty lesbian kiss, and not a dragqueen fetish… I 100% think that “Half Jack” fits my own dysphoria because I am 2 halves, a masculine and a feminine, the equal parts of my mother and my father blended to create something that doesn’t quite work as either/or. I think “sex changes” is obviously tongue in cheek humour, and it’s meant to shock the quote normal people, I love her.
In fact, I’ve SEEN people’s profile pictures on here WEARING her merchandise, and quoting her lyrics, and her merchgirl or photographer or some kind of staff member is actually on this site…So I’m hoping that someone is on my side and won’t hide behind “anonymous” So that people can discuss what an honestly nice ally she is to the queer community, she is friend’s with tegan and sara [canadian twin lesbian musicians] and has covered their songs. She plays with gender roles, and has music videos where it starts off she is a simple 1950’s housewife, who ends up in an abusive relationship, and things go downhill… But she is probably in a hierarchy of my own personal favourites? Conor Oberst/Amanda Palmer/Kurt Cobain/Tegan & Sara–Kurt being the only one I haven’t seen in concert
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January 20th, 2011 at 8:55 am |
http://genderfork.com/2010/in-the-park-2/#comments I would hope kayla or beth would be able to shine some light on the situation, but haters gonna hate I suppose. Maybe I enjoy the lyrics of being misunderstood, questioning my existence, not being what people want me to be, and dirty little euphanisms… I like things I can relate to, the fact that she covers rufus wainwright [who was really covering leonard cohen] makes her a fixture to the lgbtlmnop does it not? She’s maybe for a slightly silly crowd who like blurred lines, raunchy humour, soul crushing confessions, and being human. Not being airbrushed. And not just repeating the same 3 words to a dubstep. I am not above listening to popmusic but theres something so hollow about brushing your teeth with jack, and reading a poker face, and tonight I’m f-cking you… I have basic literacy skills, I knew the word anarchonism before I ever picked up a dresden doll record… I bought an album on vinyl in absolute blind faith because a girl I had a crush on told me I had to listen, and I trusted her so completely that I couldn’t just look for mp3s I bought it there and then on a whim. It was definitely the best investment of my summer that year. It got me closer to that girl, and has definitely made us bond, and I will always associate W.K.A.P with her.
Punk cabaret is freedom.
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January 20th, 2011 at 10:48 am |
She’s Katy Perry with drawn-on eyebrows, at best. Evidence:
http://paiwings.blogspot.com/2010/03/wtf-amanda-palmer.html
http://www.carla-lee.com/?p=28
http://disabledfeminists.com/2010/02/09/evelyn-evelyn-ableism-ableism/
http://linkspam.dreamwidth.org/23340.html
http://tigerbeatdown.com/2010/04/22/ladypalooza-presents-how-amanda-palmer-lost-a-fan-or-my-own-private-backlash/
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J.D. replied:
January 20th, 2011 at 4:08 pm
As an amendment to my post below, I read through these articles, and still don’t see anything that indicates that Amanda Palmer went out of her way to insult anyone. IMO, some people are being a little too sensitive about things. After all, from what I understand, the real people that the conjoined twins show was (loosely) based on gave her permission to impersonate them. Obviously they didn’t feel insulted. Maybe she could have been more tactful, but she’s certainly not the hateful person some of those things you’ve posted make her out to be. Obviously, you are entitled to your opinions, however much I find them to be silly.
-shrug-
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Anonymous replied:
January 22nd, 2011 at 10:31 pm
IMO, some people are being a little too sensitive about things.
Obviously, you are entitled to your opinions, however much I find them to be silly.
And I find yours to be a testament to the fact you’ve never experienced ableism. It’s really ridiculous to see someone brushing aside our concerns, as if we want to live in a world with prejudice, as if we get worked up over nothing for fun. I find it a bit offensive to see such comments on a queer site, where I would expect people to at least try to come off as sensitive, to have some experience with being othered and discriminated against. But that lack of privilege ultimately does nothing in changing how a person views anyone but their self. It’s disheartening.
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January 20th, 2011 at 11:12 am |
Amanda is awesome! ”Half Jack” has ment a lot to me, as weird as it sounds since it’s only a song. The meaning of the song and the passion with which Amanda and Brian perfomed it is really, in lack of a better word… awesome.
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January 20th, 2011 at 11:21 am |
Fen can be rather myopic about the subjects of their love.
Yeah, just go look at anon’s linkspam. I’m TAB myself, but it’s not that difficult to listen when people with disabilities tell you that something is faily on that front.
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January 20th, 2011 at 12:46 pm |
she just got maaaarried to neil gaiman
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January 20th, 2011 at 3:56 pm |
I’ve been a big fan for a while now, and I find it surprising that people could think poorly of her. In fact, I find it downright insulting (as a fan) that someone would compare her to Katy Perry.
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January 20th, 2011 at 4:04 pm |
Katy Perry is fine, she kissed a girl, she liked it…she didn’t love it enough to keep from marrying russell brand but he’s cute in a jack sparrow kind of way. I think she’s fun, I don’t relate to her lyrics much but at least her songs have lyrics. They aren’t “I whip my hair back and forth…forever”
Lady gaga I don’t even have a problem with, I just think she lacks depth and has pretty much admitted she’s in it for the cash grab, afp on the otherhand puts songs up with a “tip jar” donation, if you donate $0.00 you still get a song. This goes back to her days as a street performer, she doesn’t get record deal compensation since she took off from roadrunner her bigger but more controlling label.
I just think she doesn’t care about being famous, she’s glad for the fame she has because well it’s nice to be liked…but I think she could go much further but would have to modify her behavior and own moral compass, she’d have more money and be better known but kind of plateaus because she is in it for her art…using such forgotten instruments as pianos and not fully autotuned keyboards…and the word ‘baby’ over & over again…
Oh Evelyn Evelyn… to say you were a mistake would be upsetting to people who’s parents didn’t use condoms… because apparently every single word every single person uses is offensive to someone else… I should’ve said every individual word is offensive… single could offend people who are not currently dating, though dating is a social construct and we’re clearly above all that here at genderfork. We don’t date cause society might like it. We’re rebels. Rawr. I think a girl who’s a throwback from the 1940’s prewar americana wanting to write songs with an old timey sound, including circus lore and outlandishly goth tales that if written by tim burton would be completely acceptable, or if presented as a serious melancholy documentary would be acclaimed as the deepest most eye opening thing ever! Its all in the presentation, using humour and music as a medium to get the attention that sex trade exists, and that there are people who are orphaned in terrible outlandish accidents, there are people who misquote the bible to harm children, there are websites like myspace, these things are other facets of the album. Elephant elephant is my friend’s son’s favourite song. Its the only thing that will shut him up when he’s screaming about the chocolate he equates with affection.
And I am so glad that you guys are agreeing that abled bodied people should never play people with any kind of problem, again, sean penn that bastard plays gays and the impaired, pirates too… he was a gooood driiiiiver & going to get peter pan if it was the last thing he did, and kissed boys on camera. This shall not do. This is not what sean penn does when he wakes up on a typical day so he cannot portray this for his art!
I also think, that drake’s character on degrassi oughta just die or be cured because it’s probably insulting to be in a wheelchair if he doesn’t really need one, same with the kid on glee, I saw him walking at the awards show the other night…if you ask me…he’s a big phony faker looking for attention…I mean is artie even his real name?!? It’s offensive I tell ya, and as soon as the pc police get here…ooooh they’re gonna arrest the lotta ya. I wear a knee brace sometimes so I mean, I can absolutely go off the handle here.
I am going to be getting a calendar in the mail this week of a half nude afp, probably fully nude in some of the pictures, because she makes me so happy I want to see her 12 months of the year… I love her… I am planning a small tattoo homage to her as soon as I get my other 1/4 sleeve started…
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January 20th, 2011 at 4:36 pm |
Dude, people are getting VICIOUS. What’s up with all this ranting over a few little comments?
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Jessica replied:
January 21st, 2011 at 1:06 pm
I am amazed at the seriousness with which people express opinions: She’s a Saint — or — She’s a Nazi :: wow.
I have to conclude that she doesn’t sit on a fence well. But I am intrigued and will have to check this person out.
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January 20th, 2011 at 5:11 pm |
Yesss! I love Amanda Palmer!
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January 20th, 2011 at 5:16 pm |
So anyone who cares about issues that don’t personally affect you is “silly”.
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J.D. replied:
January 20th, 2011 at 6:14 pm
No, and its not “Silly” because of what is being cared about, its being so sensitive about something that obviously was not meant to do harm. It just seems a little unnecessary to post a bunch of angry links and make rude comments about something that – at least from my perspective – was relatively harmless. Nowhere have I ever seen Amanda state that the disabled are inferior or anything like that. Nor does she seem to be mocking them in any way. In fact, if she had, I would be upset as well and therefore I DO care about that issue despite it not personally effecting me. No, I don’t know a conjoined inividual(s), but I do know disabled individuals and am friends with some, and if anything, they’re the first to joke around about disability. Yeah, its not something to make fun of, but again, there’s nothing harmful or hateful about what Amanda Palmer did. I see why people are upset, and yes, maybe she should have clarified that she intended no harm. But seriously, this is a lot of anger over something that was inherently innocent.
Riam is right, this is getting a little cut-throat. We should all just take a deep breath.
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RedRightAnkle replied:
January 21st, 2011 at 1:59 pm
“its being so sensitive about something that obviously was not meant to do harm. It just seems a little unnecessary to post a bunch of angry links and make rude comments about something that – at least from my perspective – was relatively harmless. ”
See, this, this right here. I wish everyone here complaining about the unfathomable “sensitivity” of people pointing out ableism, how you might feel as a queer, genderqueer, trans, androgynous, or straight allied person, if after you called someone out for something heteronormative or transphobic, the other person just replied with the above quoted statement. If they just said “you’re being too sensitive” or “it’s all in your head” or “it was a joke!”
It’s annoying right, hurtful even, it makes you feel like maybe that other person doesn’t really respect you. And you can’t believe that someone would sooner defend some problematic turn of phrase or joke of questionable character than defend you or other actual people being effected by it.
Think of every gender and sexuality related microaggression that feels like a punch in the gut to you, but that you don’t say anything about because you don’t want to be told that you’re being “too sensitive.”
I totally get the knee jerk response to want to defend the things you like and enjoy, I had a similar response years ago during a discussion about how race is portrayed in Wes Anderson movies. Or when I came to terms with just how misogynistic a lot of Beatles songs are (and a lot of other bands I love too.) Or coming to terms with the complicated, somewhat hinky feminism of Joss Whedon. And yes, also as a fan of the Dresden Dolls and as someone who loved how honestly and openly Amanda Palmer sang about things like depression and being on medication and then to see that her response to the Evelyn Evelyn critiques was basically “I don’t really give a shit” and “Disabled feminists? LOL WUT?!”
Liking something doesn’t mean it’s not problematic, and something being problematic doesn’t mean we can’t still like it. It just means we shouldn’t be afraid to critically examine the things we love, that doing so doesn’t make us any less of a fan, and that when listening to the critiques of others, even if our automatic response is to want to get defensive, that we sit back, listen, and come to the discussion with as much empathy and compassion as possible.
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Anonymous replied:
January 21st, 2011 at 2:23 pm
thank you for this comment.
tigr replied:
January 21st, 2011 at 5:34 pm
When reading the comments, I was kind of thinking this… like it’s not a clear-cut area, that it’s neither that Amanda Palmer simply “hates women who don’t fit her very narrow standards, fat people and the disabled”, nor that she did everything right and nothing wrong. Just didn’t know how to put it into words; you did it much better – thanks!
“Liking something doesn’t mean it’s not problematic, and something being problematic doesn’t mean we can’t still like it. It just means we shouldn’t be afraid to critically examine the things we love, that doing so doesn’t make us any less of a fan, and that when listening to the critiques of others, even if our automatic response is to want to get defensive, that we sit back, listen, and come to the discussion with as much empathy and compassion as possible.” yes…
Anonymous replied:
December 31st, 2014 at 6:53 am
RedRightAnkle – I know it’s years after the fact but I really needed your comments today, it gave me some missing perspective and reminded me there are plenty of level-headed, open-minded folks like you and more all the time as people stop and learn to listen with the compassion you speak of. Thank you.
Anonymous replied:
January 22nd, 2011 at 10:40 pm
Not only is intent nothing, Amanda Palmer has hardly offered a mature rebuttal. I could understand defending her on those grounds otherwise, but let’s look at her response to this whole mess. She doesn’t care. She doesn’t give a damn if she offended others, and she would like to hammer this into our heads with the crudest wording and implement possible. She does not care to rescind her offensive words and statements, to issue even the most perfunctory apology. She would like to continue under the guise of being uncensored and quirky and avantgarde, of being a free spirit. Every followup to her original insult in this series of unfortunate events has been a giant “Fuck you” towards the disabled, some of these literal.
It’s not fair to paint Amanda Palmer as someone bumbling into a quagmire, suddenly waist-up in the muck of these issues. If that’s where she is now, hey. It’s pretty evident that some of that was her digging.
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January 20th, 2011 at 6:21 pm |
I don’t really ever get offended, I see things as offensive but I assume there are things to be taken at face value, and don’t always apply to me, that’s the hilarious thing. I also do not understand how no one didn’t call me on the fact that dustin hoffman and sean penn are not the same guy, why has no one pointed this out? *sigh* I do legitimately adore her… But I also think that people assuming what her every political stance is, is asinine.
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January 20th, 2011 at 8:02 pm |
wow. if i had had any interest in her, kendall would have alarmed it right out of me. so congrats there, fen! i’m pretty sure other people are allowed to have different opinions without the world ending. just saying.
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January 20th, 2011 at 8:49 pm |
Yes of course they are, that wasn’t my problem, my problem is assuming that palmer is some kind of fataphobe when often the company she keeps is on the chubby side…and that she hates the disabled when there were kids in chairs at the evelynevelyn show I attended…and hates women… This would be fine if it was “her music doesn’t appeal to me” or “I find her lyrics have nothing I relate to” or “piano is boring” instead of all of this unfounded slander against the woman personally. With being +200 pounds easily…to the point I had to have a therapist say, look just don’t use scales, you will know if you lost or gained weight when your pants don’t fit but weight is a number…and my knee brace…and my not fitting into societal standards…I MUST be hated by someone who I actually admire? I just feel it wasn’t an OPINION it was being stated as fact, and I happen to stand by the fact that she can’t be a fataphobe…considering her gig was one of the few shows where I saw XXL shirts for sale, I was so excited…I hate going to concerts and being like, oh joy…they’re already sold out of XL…Opinions are fine, its saying someone stands for something when they don’t that I found annoying, and I don’t care what people listen to, if they said her music sucked, I would’ve had no problems at all since taste is absolutely subjective, but to call someone out and be like, they’re a racist or any other sort of bigot, is a huge label to throw with nothing to back it up.
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January 20th, 2011 at 9:49 pm |
The fact that actual disabled folk/ people of color/ people with a history of sexual abuse have spoken up about how her work is offensive and her fake apologies even more so caused Palmer’s fans to dismiss, flame and *threathen* folk with a right to be angry says a lot about her fanbase.
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k replied:
January 21st, 2011 at 3:33 am
I’m disabled, in several ways, and i don’t find anything she does offensive.
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Aoede replied:
January 21st, 2011 at 6:18 am
That’s good for you. But other people do find it offensive. “I’m a woman and I don’t find it sexist!” “I’m a survivor and I thought that joke was funny!” “I’m gay and I say stuff like ‘that’s so gay’!” …that’s not a valid argument for continuing to ignore something’s participation in maintaining a culture of ignorance and/or hostility, its offensiveness to a lot of the other people it disadvantages.
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Elijah replied:
January 24th, 2011 at 3:20 pm
word.
January 21st, 2011 at 8:07 am |
I think debates about whether something in the public sphere is offensive or not, constructive or not is very interesting.
What concerns me is that Genderfork is supposed to be a positive space. Can we bring up things that trouble us? I think so. Can we debate? hell yes we can!
But I’m really uncomfortable with the amount of anger and rudeness going on in this conversation. That’s not what we’re supposed to be about here folks! Can’t we disagree in a respectful way please?
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Alex replied:
January 21st, 2011 at 11:04 am
Yes, this exactly.
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tigr replied:
January 21st, 2011 at 5:37 pm
“Can’t we disagree in a respectful way please?”
Yes, please! There’s enough not so respectful stuff going on in the ‘real’ world …
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January 21st, 2011 at 10:29 am |
Her new album just came out this morning, its all australia themed & also does a whole radiohead covers album on a ukele no less.
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January 21st, 2011 at 11:00 am |
… i submitted this and now i feel really bad.
i just liked the song, you guys. ):
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Anonymous replied:
January 21st, 2011 at 11:36 am
It’s cool, Alex–you didn’t know. It’s really rough when talented artists are knobs in their personal-and-public lives outside of their work.
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J.D. replied:
January 21st, 2011 at 12:35 pm
Alex, don’t worry, you didn’t do anything wrong, plenty of us like her, its just the few who don’t who are making a big stink about nothing. She’s hardly what she’s been made out to be by Anonymous. And no, I’m not trying to continue the argument further, but the poster deserves to know that not everyone thinks she’s a “knob” outside her work.
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Anonymous replied:
January 21st, 2011 at 1:20 pm
Nah, she acts like a pretty big knob, and some of her fans are too. Fans sending death threats to a disabled blogger calling out ableism in a body of work, and the artist in question never adressing it (and making disabled feminists part of the joke)? Not cool.
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J.D. replied:
January 21st, 2011 at 1:47 pm
Look, this is ridiculous. You’ve made your views apparent several times, so let it go. Anyone who is that big is bound to have a few psycho fans. As for the rest of your comments, they’ve already been addressed so chill, y’know? This is getting a bit too serious. She’s just a celebrity. You hating her isn’t going to make me hate her, and me liking her isn’t going to make you like her, so live and let live, y’know? We’re genderforkers, we should be able to disagree without turning into jerks.
Anonymous replied:
January 22nd, 2011 at 10:46 pm
JD, for the love of God, is there any comment in which you aren’t being completely insensitive? As much as you would like to convince us, it’s evident that you don’t care about the concerns of the disabled community. You think that any objector is making a “stink out of nothing”. As much as you preach that we should all have our own opinions, and totally just like, coexist, man, you are completely disrespectful of the all entitled to our opinions, but especially me, without appending it with a lovely little disclaimer about how positively silly we’re being. It’s like calling for a civil debate while spitting in the opposition’s face.
If this comment is moderated for being too harsh, so be it. I’ve taken my chance in order to tell you off in the most diluted language my conscience will allow. I hope you take some of it to heart, but I seriously doubt it, as you don’t seem like the type to put much stock in anyone’s opinion but your own.
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Anonymous replied:
January 22nd, 2011 at 10:48 pm
*completely disrespectful of the other side. You can’t even finish a sentence about how we’re all entitled to our opinions…
Meike replied:
January 21st, 2011 at 3:34 pm
*BIG hug to Alex* Don’t feel bad! It is a very lovely song, I also appreciate it very much.
And J.D., I absolutely agree. Disagreeing shouldn’t automatically turn us into jerks. Isn’t that part of the reason Genderfork is here, to give people a safe space to share information and opinions? If Alex’s comment is any indication, it seems we haven’t been doing that all too well. Just chill guys, take a breather.
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January 23rd, 2011 at 12:56 pm |
http://genderfork.com/2010/alex-hartley/#comments
for teh horde!!!1
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January 27th, 2011 at 5:27 am |
when I met her in Portugal I’ve never even heard about the Dresden Dolls and a friend took me to the concert cause she said “I have a feeling ur going to have a new favourite band”
they came on stage and started to throw flowers at everyone, and said “these are all for you, but if you enjoy our music feel free to throw them back at us !”
after the show they came out for a little after party, and I went up to her and said “excuse me, I just want to say that I never heard about you guys before I came here. but you are my FAVOURITE band ever.”
she awnsered “you never heard about us ?!?! ” she stared me down cause I was wearing shorts, with striped red socks, a red bow garter and a suit jacket ….SO WAS SHE !!!
then I said “yeah sweetie, telepaths of the world UNITE !right ?”
Thats when she kissed me. ^__^
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January 27th, 2011 at 5:43 am |
That’s a nice story < 3
I am linked to an chubby awkward 12 year old girl who grew up to be one of my favourite men and well over a decade ago kissed one of my favourite singers, and ended up being my first real kiss, and I like to think I vicariously kissed that singer [its not afp, but its also not important]
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